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Other people's experiences and thoughts about restrictions

Posts 31 to 60 of 623

31

Dear, Doom turtle, MsHanna, 705
I am deeply moved, and it touches my heart for your compassion and your kindness. In your place, I would have acted in the opposite direction by asking for even more severity for the offender.
Your compassion is incomprehensible to me, but I understand that there are good people on this earth and that my attitude must change radically if I want to become a "good girl".
I'm confused, I ask myself thousands of questions
I will meditate on it and I thank you again for having opened my eyes a little.
  Kisses.
sophie

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32

705 wrote:

705
Member
From: Northeast USA
Registered: 2023-06-23
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Posts: 15
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To sort of answer Sophie's questions, some of my custodial restrictions are to deprive me of foods or snack that I like but are not good for me. I am not permitted to visit convenience stores (for those not in the US, these are a type of fancy bodega) because that is an easy ways to get candy and chips. I am permitted to stop to use a restrooms on a trip but that requires explanation or permission. I could get snack at a grocery store as part of the allowed weekly shopping trip but my register receipt is sometimes but not always spot checked for what I purchased. It might be better to control this by having the supervisor approve a weekly grocery delivery order but, so far, that has been too much workload for the supervisor.

Which other custodial restrictions do apply to you besides your electronic monitoring, travel - and buying item restrictions?

Second of all how did you apply to become part of this supervision program, is there some website where you can apply for this?

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33

There are a bunch of restrictions on the apps I can have on my phone and tablet. Any new apps that I want to add have to be approved by the supervisor. There are daily limits on devices, tablet stops at 10pm, computer stops at 11pm, phone stops at 1130. There are a lot of internet sites that are restricted or I need to ask for permission to visit. All of my social media and text messages are checked for "bad" words or "bad" ideas.
This program was sort of custom designed for me but I know there are other accountability programs that can be found on the internet or through personal coaches. Mine might be a little intense because of the extensive technology but I know there are tracking programs that are non-judicial but they are expensive and only available in select locations.

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34

Dear 705, is there a system that prevents any deletion of activities on a smartphone.
Kisses
sophie

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35

Hi Sophie,
Thank you for asking. All of the parental control apps cannot be removed without the parent password so there is no way for me to remove or disable them to avoid their monitoring or restrictions. One of them, Family Link, is actually built into the operating system of the phone and tablet. I can delete text messages and browser history but it doesn't make a difference because the control apps copy all of that to a website for the parent, in this case, my supervisor to review. It is pretty hard to hide or conceal what I do.
Thank you for your questions and your input. Your thoughts on increased severity for an offender have been helpful.
Respectful hugs,
705

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36

705 wrote:

There are a bunch of restrictions on the apps I can have on my phone and tablet. Any new apps that I want to add have to be approved by the supervisor. There are daily limits on devices, tablet stops at 10pm, computer stops at 11pm, phone stops at 1130. There are a lot of internet sites that are restricted or I need to ask for permission to visit. All of my social media and text messages are checked for "bad" words or "bad" ideas.
This program was sort of custom designed for me but I know there are other accountability programs that can be found on the internet or through personal coaches. Mine might be a little intense because of the extensive technology but I know there are tracking programs that are non-judicial but they are expensive and only available in select locations.

705 wrote:

It is personal accountability as in internalizing being a better person. I am not an alcoholic although I am not permitted alcohol without permission simply as a way to add a restriction and more structure to my life.

Aspects of the program are modeled on https://www.uscourts.gov/services-forms … conditions and on methods that a person can voluntarily request the appointment of conservator or supervisor to help them better manage their life.

Enforcement can include temporary total loss of the use of devices and the internet, tighter control on the use of the internet and websites or apps I am allowed to use, a tighter curfew, greater restriction of travel or other freedom, adjustment of the requirement to report more often or having to ask for permission for things that I am usually allowed.

There is not an exit clause. There is regular review of my progress and goals are reviewed and adjusted. When I make good progress, the restrictions are adjusted to allow me more freedom for some things when I demonstrate that I can handle it.

This is a private arrangement. My supervisors are professionals in training, behavior, and coaching who have a background in creating structured environments for personal improvement and growth. They enjoy helping people to learn to help themselves and learn to make good life choices.

So your tracking program is essentially a judicial program as for as I understand it.  Therefore how costly would these non-judicial tracking programs be and to which locations are they locations are they available?

Secondly is your supervisior a parole officer given the seeming fact that your tracking program is a judicial program?

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37

Azureko1 wrote:

So your tracking program is essentially a judicial program as for as I understand it.  Therefore how costly would these non-judicial tracking programs be and to which locations are they locations are they available?

Secondly is your supervisor a parole officer given the seeming fact that your tracking program is a judicial program?

The tracking systems (ankle bracelet and tracking and reporting apps and site) are the same type of units that are used for people on parole, people who are released on bond waiting to go to trial, people who are determined to be an ongoing danger to the public, like sex offenders, and people lacking in mental capacity who might wander off. Several companies entered this market during the initial COVID pandemic when some countries used tracking devices to enforce stay at home orders. The security and accuracy of what I am wearing are about the same as what is used by the courts and bail/bond agencies in many parts of the U.S.  Some bail/bond companies offer gps tracking services for non-judicial users. Parents who want to keep track of teenagers, people who want to be able to prove they were not somewhere they were not supposed to be due to a stalking accusation. Some of the devices are able to detect alcohol through the skin. These are called SCRAM (Secure Continuous Remote Alcohol Monitor) bracelets and often include GPS tracking. Sometimes a court will order use of one of these after a DUI conviction but sometimes people will contract to wear one on their own in order to be able to refute claims that they are drinking. Sometimes this is an issue in child custody cases. Although there is a daily or monthly expense associated with monitoring, judicial or private, most wearers think it is worth it. Programs in the northeast United States seem to cost about the same as a fancy coffee two or three times a day.

My supervisor is not a parole officer but did (and does) consult with people in parole, law, law enforcement, and counseling as part of designing and revising the program.

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38

Dear 705,
your reflection that increased severity has been used on you has tickled my curiosity.
Can you tell me more?
Kisses
sophie

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39

I would have to agree! And generally learning what you and Sophie, and others have in terms of restrictions and rules, and what not is interesting to learn!

Hanna

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40

Sophie wrote:

Dear 705,
your reflection that increased severity has been used on you has tickled my curiosity.
Can you tell me more?

Dear Sophie,
Most of the increased severity has been small adjustments in the rules or my allowed schedule. My curfew was originally 9 pm every day. It was then changed to 8 pm. It was later changed to 8pm every day except Friday when it is 7 pm. Later the time I am allowed to leave the house on Saturday was changed to 11 am to 6 pm. Sunday, the curfew is for the whole day. Each time it was shortened, I was told it might be relaxed but that has not happened yet.
The reporting and verification for my tracking bracelets started out to just be occasional checks, then became every  other day, the once a day, and now seems to happen more than once on some days.
The random reminder text messages used to be sent once an hour but have recently increased to twice an hour. All of this makes it harder to forget about the supervision and monitoring even for a little while.
Sometimes during a meeting with my supervisor, they will review all of the apps that I am allowed on my phone and remove some of the ones that they don't think I need or should have. I know that they do this for my own good and to help me avoid distractions and be more productive but sometimes, I think it is just to be strict and remind me of their authority even though this authority was originally freely given.
I think they do a good job with adjusting the severity to be strict to make me better and more accountable as that is what the program is for. I try not to complain about the restictions because then I am reminded that things could always be more severe.
Respectful hugs,

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41

What if you throw away all of your technological devices including your tracking bracelets wouldn't that make life easier?

Is it easy to tamper with these tracking bracelets in case if you would like to cut them off?

Last edited by Azureko1 (2023-07-27 20:57:43)

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42

I think it would be hard to throw away all of my tech devices and start over. That is, of course, a way to end the supervision. But it would also mean losing all of the data at history that goes with the accounts. The parental control apps on the devices control the devices themselves butt he Family Link and Windows Family control access to everything that is in my Google and MS accounts. That is most of the work and contact information and the like that I have built over 20 years and stored on cloud servers. Long ago, I traded the convenience of the cloud and technology for the independence and freedom of doing things myself. That choice has the unintentional consequence of putting a lot of teeth into the tools used for my supervision. Doing without all of these would not really make my life easier.

Both of the current tracking bracelets can by off by using some king of shears on the straps. But the straps have a wire or a piece of fiber optic cable running through them so cutting them is immediately detected and an alert is set. Doing this is inadvisable. We did test a prototype of a bracelet that is two pieces that fit and lock together around the ankle without using a strap. There would be no way to cut that one off with anything less that a saw which I would not want to try that close to the body. I don't know if we will eventually use that type bracelet or not.

Thank you for your interest and your insightful questions.

Last edited by 705 (2023-07-27 21:17:05)

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43

705 wrote:

I think it would be hard to throw away all of my tech devices and start over. That is, of course, a way to end the supervision. But it would also mean losing all of the data at history that goes with the accounts. The parental control apps on the devices control the devices themselves butt he Family Link and Windows Family control access to everything that is in my Google and MS accounts. That is most of the work and contact information and the like that I have built over 20 years and stored on cloud servers. Long ago, I traded the convenience of the cloud and technology for the independence and freedom of doing things myself. That choice has the unintentional consequence of putting a lot of teeth into the tools used for my supervision. Doing without all of these would not really make my life easier.

Both of the current tracking bracelets can by off by using some king of shears on the straps. But the straps have a wire or a piece of fiber optic cable running through them so cutting them is immediately detected and an alert is set. Doing this is inadvisable. We did test a prototype of a bracelet that is two pieces that fit and lock together around the ankle without using a strap. There would be no way to cut that one off with anything less that a saw which I would not want to try that close to the body. I don't know if we will eventually use that type bracelet or not.

Thank you for your interest and your insightful questions.

Last edited by 705 (Today 21:17:05)

You have an intresting story to tell so I appreciate your detailed responses.  Are you employed in the IT industry by mere happenstance?

Secondly are your tracking bracelets also equiped with an remote alcohol detector and what is the model of that prototype of bracelet that fit and lock together around the ankle which you tested yourself?

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44

Azureko1 wrote:

You have an interesting story to tell so I appreciate your detailed responses.  Are you employed in the IT industry by mere happenstance?

Secondly are your tracking bracelets also equipped with an remote alcohol detector and what is the model of that prototype of bracelet that fit and lock together around the ankle which you tested yourself?

I am glad that you enjoy the responses. Having to be consciously transparent helps to reinforce the program, I think.

I do a couple of different things but IT related is one of them. That has made designing and living with this program a challenge from a data security standpoint.

Neither of my bracelets have the transdermal alcohol detection but that is not an issue. I seldom used alcohol before we began and now the program forbids it without explicit permission. It does not seem to be worth checking with a device. I am subject to random drug testing. Again, I don't use controlled substances. I think this is more of a humiliation and show of authority issue.

I will see if I can talk about the model of the new bracelet we tested. It is similar in shape and design to the Xexun DDX-14 that is available from China. We have tried that one, also. It has some issues but they can be overcome. From a security standpoint, it would be good to rotate devices as a best practice.

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45

705 wrote:

.

I do a couple of different things but IT related is one of them. That has made designing and living with this program a challenge from a data security standpoint.

Intresting, I also work in IT. In which sense does this program challenge living and designing from a data security point whilst being presumably a consultant towards a demanding client?

705 wrote:

I will see if I can talk about the model of the new bracelet we tested. It is similar in shape and design to the Xexun DDX-14 that is available from China. We have tried that one, also. It has some issues but they can be overcome.

What sort of Issues did you run with the Xexun DDX-14 personally? That the locking system was too uncomfortable to use when in contact with the skin or?

Last edited by Azureko1 (2023-07-29 00:23:49)

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46

The big data security issue with my supervision is that I don't have all of the access that a normal phone or computer user would have. I need help from a "parent", that is my supervisor to install apps on the phone or to do anything that needs an administrator on the computer. This is sometimes inconvenient especially working in front of a customer. It needs planning and good communication on my part which is what the program is supposed to instill. So all of this is for my benefit. It is just sometimes hard. Some thing are impossible. The parental apps on the phone and tablet control a lot of the network settings to provide the protection they provide so some user level things are not possible. My DNS is forced to a server that monitor and restricts browsing so I can't use other custom DNS servers to test some things for customers from my devices. The control apps force a particular VPN to control internet traffic so this can sometimes be an issue with access through some firewalls or other onsite security.

The DDX14 seems to be a good unit and is comfortable to wear for me. The fixed size my be an issue for other sized ankles but I think that can be overcome in several ways. We have not had a good chance to test battery life and gps and network coverage inside buildings. In some brief trials, it seems to be close to the omnilink in coverage. The biggest issue is the instructions for use which have required a lot of trial and error, guessing, debugging to get the units to work in the U.S. They may be better out of the box when used in China. Another issue is the website but that can be overcome with some work that will allow customization. It is a work in progress.

For non-tech or non-geek readers, I apologize for all of the technical detail that is not directly related to the thought and practice of personal restriction.

Last edited by 705 (2023-07-29 05:15:06)

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47

705 wrote:

The big data security issue with my supervision is that I don't have all of the access that a normal phone or computer user would have. I need help from a "parent", that is my supervisor to install apps on the phone or to do anything that needs an administrator on the computer. This is sometimes inconvenient especially working in front of a customer. It needs planning and good communication on my part which is what the program is supposed to instill. So all of this is for my benefit. It is just sometimes hard. Some thing are impossible. The parental apps on the phone and tablet control a lot of the network settings to provide the protection they provide so some user level things are not possible. My DNS is forced to a server that monitor and restricts browsing so I can't use other custom DNS servers to test some things for customers from my devices. The control apps force a particular VPN to control internet traffic so this can sometimes be an issue with access through some firewalls or other onsite security.

The DDX14 seems to be a good unit and is comfortable to wear for me. The fixed size my be an issue for other sized ankles but I think that can be overcome in several ways. We have not had a good chance to test battery life and gps and network coverage inside buildings. In some brief trials, it seems to be close to the omnilink in coverage. The biggest issue is the instructions for use which have required a lot of trial and error, guessing, debugging to get the units to work in the U.S. They may be better out of the box when used in China. Another issue is the website but that can be overcome with some work that will allow customization. It is a work in progress.

For non-tech or non-geek readers, I apologize for all of the technical detail that is not directly related to the thought and practice of personal restriction.

Last edited by 705 (2023-07-29 05:15:06)

Not having the ability do define your custom DNS servers on your own devices is like digital cuckcoldry from a network engineering perspective but how do your clients react to this if you can't test some settings for them?

Did you test the DDX14 at the location of the manufacturer or distributor?

Concerning the issue of the website you mention , is that the website where you have to upload your ankle bracelet checks is that also the problem where you can't connect towards it?

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48

Azureko1 wrote:

Not having the ability do define your custom DNS servers on your own devices is like digital cuckcoldry from a network engineering perspective but how do your clients react to this if you can't test some settings for them?

Did you test the DDX14 at the location of the manufacturer or distributor?

Concerning the issue of the website you mention , is that the website where you have to upload your ankle bracelet checks is that also the problem where you can't connect towards it?

Digital cuckcoldry is a good term. I like that. It is usually not a problem that I cannot test settings from my personal devices. I use looking glass sites like DNSTools and similar. They provide more comprehensives results and the ability to do checking from multiple locations. But even though I use them because it is a better choice, it is still a reminder that I am not permitted access to some of my own configuration settings.

I purchased a DDX14 from an internet distributor and eventually a second unit directly from the manufacturer. There has been a lot of back and forth with their tech support to get the device to work in the United States. The website is a tracking management website provided by the manufacturer. It doesn't really meet the needs of the supervision program I am under. It is difficult to use and does not have all of the features necessary for the supervision of someone who is allowed time out in the community.

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705 wrote:

I purchased a DDX14 from an internet distributor and eventually a second unit directly from the manufacturer. There has been a lot of back and forth with their tech support to get the device to work in the United States. The website is a tracking management website provided by the manufacturer. It doesn't really meet the needs of the supervision program I am under. It is difficult to use and does not have all of the features necessary for the supervision of someone who is allowed time out in the community.

Maybe you could outsource the work to some Indian remote worker to tailor the website to your custom supervision program if in case budget is limited  :P

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Perhaps.  But some of the work I do is helping out with fixing some of that low cost outsourced work.

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705 wrote:

Perhaps.  But some of the work I do is helping out with fixing some of that low cost outsourced work.

Which sort of work do you do so fix the situation?

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Azureko1 wrote:

Which sort of work do you do so fix the situation?

It is usually fixing incorrect or non-working code or finishing jobs for coders who disappeared in the middle of a job. Sometimes, it is working to clarify specifications to get what the customer wants. I have not seen a lot of good results with low cost Indian workers. Central European outsourcing seems to be better but not at as much of a discount cost. The big advantage is the availability of talent but often at prices equivalent to in the U.S.

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53

Dear Sophie,

Because you have advocated strictness for prisoners and people in in our situation, I thought you would be interested (and maybe pleased) to know that yesterday I was told that I had an additional restriction. I used to be allowed to meet for meals with anyone I choose for meals as long as I kept my curfew and followed the rules about notifying if I went past a certain distance from home. Now, if I am meeting a female friend, it will require specific approval to provide "guidnace for making good use of my time". I have asked to meet a friend on Monday. We will see what happens.

Respectful hugs,

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54

Dear 705,

Thank you for sharing all these insightful pieces of information. Your new rule seems weirdly specific, was there any particular event that may have forced your supervisors to introduce it? Why does it include only female friends?

The technical details were interesting and relevant. I am not much into networking, but I think I understand enough to appreciate it. Is there anything that would effectively stop you from copying your most important data from Google and MS accounts onto a pendrive?

As for the bracelets, given that you live and also leave your premises alone (away from the controllers), it is important that you can remove them yourself in case of medical emergency.

All the best,
The Turtle of Doom

Last edited by DoomTurtle (2023-08-05 18:43:30)

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55

Dear 705,
anything that makes other people's lives more difficult makes me happy, even if I'm beginning to understand that it's a bad attitude.
Do you know the criteria to be able to meet a friend, do you have to give their contact details?
Kisses.
sophie

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56

Dear Sophie,

I am glad that my added restriction makes you happy. I do not think that it is necessarily a bad attitude. The idea that my restrictions make you happy helps me to accept them as not only good for me but also good for someone else. So, thank you for your help and reinforcement. Nonetheless,  that does not make it less restrictive or embarrassing to have to ask to be allowed to meet with people who have been friends for a long time. I know that it is good for someone who is in custody or under supervision to have close attention paid to who they associate with and how they spend their time.
I don't know what the criteria are to decide if a meeting will be allowed. Nothing specific has been said yet. So far it has only been one person, who is known to the supervisor so I don't know what will be required to be allowed to meet someone new. I doubt that it will be easy and it is likely that the process will make you happy ;-)

Respectful hugs,
705

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57

Dear 705,
  it's true that I like to know that others are held in strict discipline, but if it helps you, I'm happy too. The only thing that's annoying is that you stir up my bad instincts, which also risks hardening my discipline.
Thank you for your compassion and for keeping us informed of developments in your control.
Kisses
sophie

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58

Have you noticed my previous post, 705? I hope I haven't written anything that you might consider inappropriate or that you aren't allowed to discuss. I certainly haven't intended so. In such case, of course, let me apologise.

Dear Sophie, I think it isn't so bad that you enjoy reading about someone's consensual lifestyle changes and strict discipline. If you enjoyed the fact that somebody is oppressed against their will, obviously that would be a very serious attitude problem, but I believe you don't have such feelings? Anyway, we don't really know your patterns of behaviour. When your bad instincts rise up, your educators will have to notice it and react, so you know the need to control yourself and improve your mentality to be a "good girl".

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Dear DoomTurtle,

For some reason, I just saw your last post now even thought it looks like it was posted before Sophie's post that I replied to. You said nothing inappropriate at all. I appreciate your interest and your concern. If there were anything I was not able to discuss, I am supposed to say that and explain why but I cannot think of what might fall into that category.

I am not sure what prompted the additional restriction. I made the required notification that I was traveling outside of my three county area to have dinner with my friend J.  I received a message that this would be allowed so I asked if that travel now required approval rather than notification. (Travel out of the state requires prior approval. Travel out of my local county and the two adjacent counties requires notification, I can travel freely with a few restrictions in the three county area.)  I was told that dinner with J requires approval. I asked if it applied to other regular dinner partners and was told "indeed". I asked women only or anyone and was told "women only for now". I was told it was "Guidance for making good choices with your time". So i don't know if there was a specific reason or if there will just be more attention paid to what I do.

I could copy all of my cloud stuff to local storage but there is a lot, probably 4 ot 5 terabytes. I have been a Google user since the beginning of Gmail. It would be hard to recreate all of that functionality locally and I would have to figure out how to safely access from elsewhere.  I would lose a long established identity on the net and if I created another account (if I could even do that. I am not sure) I would have to update a lot of people as to my new information and reshare items with them.
In any case, the supervision program is supposed to be good for me and I am not supposed to fight it or try to evade the restrictions because there would be consequences for that. It is also a matter of integrity. I accepted to do this because it is good for me and it would be wrong to stop. A lot of the reminder messages that I get focus on reinforcing this idea and I suppose, it is working.

You are right. Because I am not in close proximity to the controllers the bracelets I am currently wearing can be removed in an emergency by simply cutting the straps with a pair of strong Emergency Medical Technician (EMT) shears. This would generate a strap alarm but could be done if necessary.

Thank you for your interest. Your questions are very helpful as I reflect on what I am doing.

What makes you the Turtle of Doom?

Respectfully,

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60

Dear Sophie,

I am sorry that I stir up your bad instincts and might get you in trouble. I will keep answering any questions you may have and will let you know about any changes for me. I hope your supervisors and mine do not think that I am a bad influence on you. I am pretty sure mine would not approve of that.

Thank you for your note.

Respectful hugs,

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